Jay (00:03)
Welcome to the Dive Table. I'm Jay Gardner.
Sarah (00:07)
And I'm Sarah Miller. And today we're going to be talking about diving and nutrition because we have firsthand experience of screwing it up horribly. What happened, Jay?
Jay (00:20)
Yes, we do. Well, I want to give a first a shout out to all those that joined us at our meetup in San Diego. There are about 10 people, I think, total that came out and six of us went diving. And it was awesome to get to know some of you that joined us and folks I'd never met before and go diving together. I think we had a beautiful little dive out at La Jolla Shores.
broke up into three teams of two, tried to stay together, which we did for all of us. We did.
Sarah (00:52)
We did stay together, yeah. Yeah, it was a good dive. Visibility was nice, conditions were pretty good. It was pretty mellow getting out into the water. And yeah, we saw some cool stuff too.
Jay (01:05)
Yeah, the coolest ginormous angelfish or angelfish, not angelfish, angelfshark I've seen was there. I mean, it was big and it was a rare thing to see. So that was pretty amazing.
Sarah (01:18)
Yeah, very cool. I have to admit though that surface swim is quite the surface swim. It's a big one.
Jay (01:27)
hahahaha
I've been joking about it forever, you know, since I moved here about, you know, the first time I went out, I don't remember what episode this was on, but I talked about how I got my butt kicked pretty good with that surface swim and a bunch of other things, having been diving and all this stuff. But it's no joke. It's...
Sarah (01:50)
Well, and the waves can be pretty dicey. I mean, luckily for our meetup, that first dive in the morning, it was pretty mellow. We were able to calmly get our fins on in the surf zone and kind of get out, and it wasn't a big deal. But you and I hung out with people for a while and didn't properly hydrate or eat because I think we were a little bit excited about.
having people there and a little distracted. And so when we went out for that second dive, we just got beat up by waves. Like, I mean, we handled it great. Like I was impressed. Again, that was the first time that we had been diving together. And I was happy to dive with you because both of us could handle ourselves, but it was just kind of funny. We were getting out there, just getting our butts handed to us.
Jay (02:46)
Yeah, yeah. And you said, we forgot to properly eat or drinking. I think the right phrase is we forgot to eat or drink anything, not even properly, just period. Like a little bit of water, maybe is all I had. And soda, I think I had at one point.
Sarah (02:58)
Yeah, yeah, I had a water and a really sugary cookie, which is just not what you need. But that's what prompted this discussion because we went diving again, a couple of days actually, we went to La Jolla Cove and then just yesterday to Laguna and we did a heck of a lot better with that and both of us felt better after the dives. Even though they weren't
they weren't necessarily easy, right? We did another dive with a long surface swim. Yesterday in Laguna we got rocked by some surge in the crevice at Shaw's Cove. So it wasn't necessarily like calm, simple, easy diving, but we fueled our bodies properly for it.
Jay (03:50)
We did, we did. And I think that's a good point that you bring up is that during the dive, our second dive at La Jolla Shores, I mean, we were both fine. We weren't, you know, we didn't experience a cramp. No one, you know, got overexerted. We weren't overly cold and called to dive because of that. But what happened was after the dive, once we went home, broke the gear down, all that stuff, both you and I, independently, didn't feel very good.
Sarah (04:03)
No.
Jay (04:17)
We were just kind of like, it wasn't bent. It wasn't that kind of feeling of like, oh, something's wrong. It was just, oh, my body is sore. I'm tired. Um, you know, uh, yeah. And sometimes that's true with, with not fueling for a dive or, or proper nutrition, hydration. The effects of it are felt afterwards. I remember my first scuba instructor, um, said to me, you know, Oh yeah, you know, the best part about scuba for me. And I was like, I don't know the under being underwater, the fish, the.
Sarah (04:24)
Tired. Yeah.
Jay (04:46)
You know, the gear, I was expecting some profound answers. Like, no, you know, the scuba nap. And I was like, oh, okay, interesting. As I've gone on in diving, I've realized, oh man, that guy's probably not, you know, eating correctly for the diving and hydrating correctly. And also maybe possibly not decompressing correctly. If that's, he's like, every time I go to the scuba dive, I just feel so tired afterwards. And that nap is something else.
And that might be true, physical exertion, all those things, but it's, it's had that like in my head of, you know, oftentimes when I don't eat right or I don't prepare right for the dive, I feel the same way. It's time for a scuba nap and, uh, and want to take it. So anyway, kind of a side story of how it relates to all this stuff, but it stuck out to me for so long of like, as I've learned more of diving, that comment has taken on different meaning throughout that time.
Sarah (05:42)
Yeah, for me, it's really important to have those electrolytes. I can drink purified water all day and it doesn't do anything. It's about getting those electrolytes. I tend to be a little hippie about it and make my own because I don't like the Gatorades and things in the world. It's too sugary. It's just kind of gross, especially the color. I can't get down with like...
something that's blue, like neon blue or orange or whatever. So I'll put together like a salt and lime combo sort of thing, like good salt. And that will be part of my fueling plan for the day whenever I go diving. Or if I'm doing any kind of exercise, like intense exercise or trip or whatever, or I'm in a really hot environment,
Jay (06:15)
Ah, right.
Sarah (06:40)
dealing with a dry suit in a hot environment, right? California, that can be the case. Just making sure that I get enough liquid, like the proper kind of liquid, not sodas or whatever.
Jay (06:53)
Yeah, it's funny. So you and my wife would get along great because she is fully in on the Celtic salt, sea salt, water and lime or lemon. That's kind of what she drinks and constantly fueling. Because that breaks the electrolytes actually fuel each cell. Like you're actually hydrating each cell in your body and that's how it happens.
Sarah (06:57)
Yeah.
Jay (07:20)
Um, I personally just can't drink the salt water. I've tried. I just, it's gross to me. It's like, you know, I like room temperature, you know, tap water. I'm happy with that. Right. But to your point, I've realized the same thing around, okay, I can drink water all day long. That's not necessarily meaning I'm hydrated. So I need to add the electrolytes in. So I've experimented with the Gatorades and things like that and agree with you, you know, turning your, your.
your tongue blue and your face blue and all these things from Blue Gatorade. What I've found and I really like both from a travel perspective when I'm traveling diving and just from a taste and electrolytes perspective is they've been coming out with these new little packets and you can find a lot of them that are sugar-free, which is great. But they're basically packets of powder.
for lack of a better word, that includes salt and different types of electrolytes, magnesium, calcium, so on and so forth. And you can just pour them into your water bottle and it mixes it together and there you have something that's tasty, at least to me, not salt water, and is accomplishing the job and isn't a big sugary drink and doesn't turn your drink purple or blue or red. It's just an additive to the water. And I think Liquid IV is one of them.
that I've used. I forget the names of the other ones, but you can find them in a grocery store or on Amazon.
Sarah (08:54)
Yeah, they're all over the place. They also sell them in tubes and tablets too, right? You can just drop the tablet into the water. So that's a good way to take something on the go. I use those occasionally. Like when I was in Playa del Carmen, I ended up buying some of that because I couldn't find my normal ingredients for my hippie dippy concoction.
So that was the solution. It was like, well, I need something because I am going to feel like garbage if I don't. That's really like the main thing for me. Obviously, food is also a part of it. But I definitely like my priorities on a dive day are hydration because that will take me out right at the knees. I will completely fall apart if I don't hydrate.
Jay (09:48)
Yeah, so how do you approach the timeline of that? So let's say the first dive is scheduled 9 a.m. Let's just say that that's when you guys are planning on getting in the water and going diving. How far back, are you talking the night before, the day before, the morning when you wake up? How do you kind of manage the timing of how you're hydrating and focusing on that dive?
Sarah (10:14)
Yeah, I haven't been, I mean, I'll be totally honest about this because I've been honest on my YouTube channel with this too. Like I've struggled with diving in a dry suit and getting this just right because I do not have a P-valve. And that is just a situation that I need to manage. So I always hydrate the night before. That's something that is easy because, you know, you're going to deal with.
Jay (10:32)
Yeah.
Sarah (10:43)
your liquids before you get out to the dive site. As far as the day of, I tried to be very mindful about how much volume I'm taking in. So I wanna get like bang for my buck, have it be something that's high in electrolytes. I am a huge coffee addict. So like I will have my cup of coffee in the morning, but.
instead of having, like I usually probably have two or three cups of coffee during the day. That's probably not the best. Don't do what I'm doing. But on a dive day, I only have one. So that's how I adjust so that one, I'm not overly dehydrating myself and two, I'm not having to pee every 30 minutes. So that's sort of my thing during the day, like all, or before.
I get into the water, I'll make sure to have one last sip of something before I grab all my gear and head down to the water. And then ideally I come back and immediately start hydrating again. It depends on the plan for the rest of the day, how much volume I will drink.
but I really, I'm usually good at like feeling what my body needs. It's days like our meetup when I'm, well honestly that day I was kind of tired too. Like I had just driven from Baja and I just like, a lot of things have been going on. So I was tired, but also like excited about being there and having people and.
doing this whole thing, right? Like meetups are very exciting to me. So I'm not as good at listening to my body when I'm distracted like that, right? So that's something that I have to be aware of and to try to combat, you know, to like overcome that. And I'm not perfect at it by any means.
Jay (12:42)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, it's an interesting thing. I mean, my firsthand kind of story where this became important in my diving in terms of nutrition and hydration, I was on a dive, I remember I was just kind of learning or dialing in my back kick. And so it was just starting to come together, which is for those of you out there that have struggled with the back kick, you'll know what I'm saying. It's an exciting time when it finally starts to come together. For those of you that
figure it out on your first few kicks. Like God bless you, but it wasn't me. It wasn't me. It took me a while to learn that, but, uh, just learning that we're going on a dive. It was a larger group night dive. We're going to go see this old paddle boat that was in, uh, in this lake that had been sunk and the remnants of it. And I remember kind of going down diving. Everything's okay. We get down to the little wreck and, um, you know, I do.
Sarah (13:32)
Yeah, me neither. Me neither.
Jay (13:56)
go to do my first back kick, you know, to engage. And you're so focused on the technique and your body position. And it's something that takes that mental capacity. And my first back kick, both of my calves cramped, like at the same time. And it was terrifying because you lose all your propulsion. Like all you're thinking about in that moment is how much that hurts.
And, uh, and then you're, um, vertical, you're not, you know, you feel like you're sinking, you feel like you can't kick cause you can't move your legs. You're just, you know, it's so uncomfortable and all this stuff. And finally, uh, you know, the diver that was with me, you know, figured out something was wrong and I'm, you know, giving them the cramp signal. And it's like, which one? I'm like, both. Just take one, you know, and he stretched me out a little bit and, and it just stayed, you know, there the whole dive. And it's, it's a history. I've had a history of.
Sarah (14:42)
Hehehehehehe
Yeah.
Jay (14:53)
cramps, playing basketball and all sorts of things. And so that really kicked me over and I felt like, oh man, I'm doing what I, you know, I'm drinking water, which I was, you know, and I'm eating a banana before the dive, which was recommended to me in my open water dive and all this stuff. I thought I was doing all the right things. And when I dug into it, it's a lot more than, at least for people like me that, you know, my goal in all of this is to avoid a cramp. I mean, honestly, I am terrified of cramps. I hate cramps.
Sarah (15:22)
No.
Jay (15:23)
And so, you know, I, I am very focused on that aspect, simply to avoid the cramps. And so the timing of things I get a little bit more, I think you're really good at the intuition and I I'm a little more like, I need to write it down or have a schedule for me because I'm not as intuitive to my body. It's not something that somebody I'm working on, but I'm not there yet by any means.
Sarah (15:42)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. Oh, it's a long journey, to be honest. Like, it's not something that you're like, oh, I'm going to get into intuitive eating and I'm going to, you know, whatever. Like, it takes a lot of practice. I was hearing an alarm. I think that was on your side. Okay.
Jay (16:04)
Yeah, sorry. Hey, Daniel, my alarms went off on my watch. I don't know why that's set free right now, but yeah, we'll reset and redo.
Sarah (16:11)
That's okay. No, it's all good. So yeah, intuitive eating isn't something that just like, it takes a lot of practice and it's a lot of adjustment. One thing that you said though, I think is a common misconception that like, oh, I'll just have a banana right before the dive and I'll be fine, right? Like that's actually not how cramps work.
Right? Like you can't, especially right before the dive, like your body's not even gonna have a chance to get anything from that banana, you know? So really what it's about, at least from my experience, has been eating really well-rounded whole food items, right? Like not having the processed foods, getting...
Jay (16:40)
No.
Yeah.
Sarah (17:04)
complex proteins, fats, carbs, like just everything. And it really has to, it depends also on the type of diving that I'm doing. So like there was a season when I had my dive boat in Indonesia that eating before getting on the boat would make me feel sick, like absolutely sick for the first dive. And so I paid attention to that and was like, okay, I can't.
I can't have like a big breakfast before I go out on these long drives on the boat. So I changed it and then I would get nutrition from other places and during different times during the day, right? Like after we've already done the big crossing, I can eat more once we're actually in the Komodo National Park. And that would work for me, but I had to pay attention, right?
Jay (17:59)
Mm-hmm.
Sarah (18:00)
And the main thing is just staying away, like for me at least, staying away from the processed foods. Like even something like a protein bar, like it's fine if you're in a pinch. Like the other day, that was what was in the car and I was hungry and so I went for it. But like it's much better for me and my body to have fruits and nuts and like a sandwich or anything that's like more
just non-processed stuff. And yes, you were correct about me and your wife getting along. We actually didn't mention this. I'm sitting on Jay's property at this moment right now. And so I've gotten to meet his wife and his wife is amazing. I absolutely adore her. But we tried to figure out how to record this podcast, like sitting in the same room like normal podcasters do.
Jay (18:40)
Ha ha ha, yes.
Like normal human beings, yeah.
Sarah (18:54)
Yeah, but we just the technology just did not want to work for us in that. So I'm sitting in his backyard while he's in his office.
Jay (19:05)
Yeah, it's funny when you're set up for remote recording, when you're in the same place, you're like, uh, what do we do now? Cause we're, we're so set up for remote recording. Uh, so yeah, no, you bring up a really good point too. I mean, the amount of bananas you'd have to eat before a dive, uh, even the day before to get the amount of potassium that you would need, you know, to avoid the cramps or to hydrate correctly is, is a lot.
Sarah (19:15)
Yeah.
Jay (19:32)
I mean, unless you really love bananas, you know, that's probably not the greatest strategy, but that's, that's kind of what, uh, what I've been told, you know, eat a banana and drink some water and you'll be fine. And so I went on this journey like you. Um, I think from a hydration perspective, absolutely. Uh, the electrolytes are important, all of that, but it wasn't until I started to look at the nutrition side of it, that the cramps really went away. And I'm happy to say it's been a long time since I've had, you know, a cramp underwater.
Sarah (19:58)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Jay (20:03)
For me, it's the complex slow burning foods, things that take a while to burn. So things like whole grain rice, beans, in whatever format, refried beans, black beans, lentils, whatever types of legumes and things that you can add in for whatever it is for my body really help that slower digestion, slower burn.
Sarah (20:31)
Absolutely. Yeah.
Jay (20:33)
Um, I love to take on a dive boat or in the truck with me, um, you know, on those days, like a big thing of grapes, grapes are mostly water, you know? And so again, you're having a little bit of, of grapes and there's nothing better on a hot Texas day. I'll just say it out loud. Then grapes out of the cooler. I'll just, it's the most amazing. You pop a grape and it's hydrating and it's cool and refreshing and it tastes good. And, oh, so happy you have something to say about grapes. I can tell.
What is it about Graves? You're not a fan?
Sarah (21:06)
I'm, I, no, grapes are fine. I, so I'm laughing because I've literally eaten enough grapes to last me a lifetime because my previous life was working as a wine maker. So like walking through vineyards and like eating and tasting the grapes and like processing them and everything like, so whenever somebody's like, hey, let's have some grapes. I'm like, huh, like, oh no, I don't want it. I don't want it.
Jay (21:09)
Ha ha!
Oh, there you go.
UGH! HAHAHAHAHA!
Sarah (21:34)
but I totally hear you.
Jay (21:35)
Well, in you, you have the good grapes, like being a winemaker, you have the good grapes, right? Yeah.
Sarah (21:39)
Very sweet, very, very sweet. Much sweeter than normal table grapes. But anyway, no, grapes are fine. I just have like a, you know, I have a automatic response to that. Yeah, it's like, oh gosh, not more grapes.
Jay (21:45)
Yeah.
reaction to them.
Yeah, it's so funny. Yeah. I remember being in Paris, uh, on our honeymoon actually. And we had gone to a market and just bought some snack stuff to sit out in a park and have a little, you know, lunch. And grapes were one of the things that we bought from the little market. I remember eating my first grape, you know, sitting there and I'm like, Whoa, like this is not a great, this is something else. This is amazing. Cause all I'd ever had was table grapes, you know, growing up with the green or the purple table grapes, and they were just.
you know, mind boggling, tasty. So, um.
Sarah (22:26)
Well, it was probably, they were probably still table grapes, but they were European grapes, which are very different. The produce and things that we get from conventional farming here in the United States are not great, not great. We don't need to go into the details of everything with that, but like, it's really, it's a thing. Like you go to...
Jay (22:32)
Yeah
grid.
Sarah (22:53)
stores in Europe and the quality is just, it's different. And you can tell. And you probably don't feel as sick when you eat stuff over there. So it's a whole thing. So buying good quality is a, no, buying good quality, it's important. It's like, that's something that I'm excited about being back in California.
Jay (23:06)
And we should actually do... Oh, sorry.
Sarah (23:17)
after being in Baja, not that like food in Baja, it's again, different country, different regulations and everything, the food was great there. But I'm excited to like visit the small farms that we have, especially where I'm from, like the central coast, we have so many, so many good farms and farmers markets, because the quality and the way that you feel eating that kind of food is, it's just different. It makes me feel better for sure. And that's what I need to be able to do.
crazy things like swimming at La Jolla Shores.
Jay (23:51)
Yeah, I was going to say we should do an episode at some point because the food system is so interconnected with our waterway system and how all those things connect. But.
Sarah (24:00)
It is. We need somebody much smarter to talk about that, though. Like the farm runoff and all of that, because I know the basics, but like I think we could find somebody who could speak much more intelligently on that.
Jay (24:06)
Agreed.
Yeah, no, we will plan a series or something, pull some people on that really know their stuff. And because it's, I was a skeptic. So all those out there, you know, that might be listening that have been in the boat of, you know, organic. I remember making the argument a long time ago. Well, everything's organic. I mean, what does that mean? Right. It's a, I mean, it's still an organism. All right. It's how it relates or, you know, pesticides or conventional or process and all these sorts of things. I just wasn't raised.
in a way that there was capacity to think about nutrition, right? I mean, the most I... Yeah.
Sarah (24:49)
Well, you can't when you're poor. Like, we've had this discussion so many times. You just can't have that discussion because you're priced out of it. It's like you're just destined to be sick, which we're getting into a big conversation there.
Jay (25:01)
Yep, yeah, it's true. And I mean, we're going to all hold down, but it's nice to talk about it because nutrition is one of those things as it relates to diving. I always talk about food and nutrition and those things. It's such a complex pie. Like if you made a pie graph of all the things that go into it, I mean, you're talking about finances, sure. You're talking about health. You're talking about the way you were raised. You're talking about location, what's available to you. Like you just talked about.
Sarah (25:09)
Mm.
Mm-hmm food deserts and stuff. Yeah
Jay (25:33)
You're talking about emotions, how food makes you feel. You're talking about social, what other people are eating or is available to them or what's pie. And then the list goes on. And so like in raising kids that we want to be nutritionally intelligent, if you take one slice of that pie and optimize for it, for example, take two extremes. One extreme being, we take the only slice of the pie
Sarah (25:37)
Mm-hmm.
Jay (26:01)
being emotions and we eat based on what makes us feel good. I'd weigh 500 pounds, easy, you know, like it just happened, you know, like, because the things that make me feel good are like sugary, yummy, you know, let's eat cake for breakfast, like no big deal. So that's not good. But if you take only the slice of, let's say health into the equation, well, then,
Sarah (26:09)
Ha ha
Jay (26:29)
for people like me who have a lot of enjoyment of eating food, you're missing, you're kind of creating this emotional void, right? In some ways that what used to be there. So you, so it's this balancing act of understanding, you know, the different components and trying to balance out the things that you want to optimize, but not go extreme in some ways. And that's been, um, an eyeopening journey for me the last few years as of, as I've had capacity.
Sarah (26:37)
Hmm
Jay (26:59)
and have been educating myself and challenging myself and those sorts of things to learn about nutrition. Of course, because I wanna be a diver as long as I possibly can and our health and our nutrition that goes into our health has a lot to say about how long we can do this activity.
Sarah (27:08)
Yeah.
Well, and I say, I always say like our first medicine for our health and wellness is the food that we put in our bodies. Like that you want to be treating food as medicine so that you don't have to rely on Western, you know, pills and things to deal with stuff. Obviously it's there for the cases that you do need that kind of an intervention, but like setting yourself up for success.
by fueling your body with good, high quality food. Like that, it's, to me, it's the only way to go. But it takes time to get there and you have to be really like soft and like gentle with yourself as you're exploring this. Because especially in the United States, we have such a weird, like weird relationship with food. It's a cultural thing. And, you know, like you were saying, like the social aspect of stuff.
and emotional aspect. It's for me, and I'm gonna be that stereotypical vegetarian for a second, because they say the joke of like, you know how you'll know that your friend is a vegetarian? Like they'll tell you straight away or something like that. I don't remember the whole joke, but like, yeah, like they just tell you automatically. So yes, I am vegetarian. I'm sorry, not sorry, whatever. But what...
Jay (28:25)
Ha ha!
Same tech diver joke, right?
Sarah (28:42)
that transition did for me was it allowed, it like made me try different things that I was closed off to. So like before I went vegetarian, hated tomatoes, hated eggplant, hated like all of these things in the veggie fruit family, right? But I tried being vegetarian for a little while just as like a, you know, let's see if I can do this kind of thing. And I found that I started to
Jay (28:50)
Mm-hmm.
Sarah (29:11)
enjoy those things. And I was like, oh, that's odd. And then I started to correlate, like instead of that what you described of like, this cake will make me feel really, you know, I enjoy this, like I wanna have cake for breakfast. The intuitive eating part of it is like, okay, it tastes good for those.
30 seconds that it's in your that's a long time, like 10 seconds that it's in your mouth or whatever. I mean, you're like swirling it around. But like it tastes. Yeah, it tastes good for that little bit. But then what are the consequences of that food going into your body and getting processed by your body? Does it still feel good when you're sitting in it? Right. And what I found is when I started eating the
Jay (29:42)
Yeah.
Yeah, that's a big bite of cake.
Sarah (30:06)
more fruits and veg, I would continue to feel good throughout the day. Whereas when I had, you know, either refined sugar or, you know, for me at this point, I've been vegetarian for about 10 years, if I had meat, I would probably be sick to my stomach if I had anything. Like, if I wanted to go back to eating meat, I would have to do it very intentionally and slowly because my body is just not used to processing that, right?
And so that was the thing because I love chocolate, I love cookies, I love all of those things and nothing to me is like bad quote unquote, but I have to understand if I have one cookie, I'm gonna feel fine, right? Cause it's like my body can process that and it's not too much. If I have three cookies, I'm gonna wanna die. Like my stomach's gonna be upset, I'm gonna have cramps, like I'm gonna have that peak of like
Jay (30:58)
Right.
Sarah (31:03)
intense sugar rush and then I'm gonna have the crazy crash after where I just feel like dog crap and So that's like the experience and taking in that data like you were talking about how you've been writing down your diet and things That was like a necessary phase to get to this place of like Understanding what I actually need
Jay (31:28)
Yeah, yeah, I know you bring up a really good point in there. I mean, we, uh, as a family, we were vegetarian for three years as a, uh, we tempted that and, um, and it was interesting because I think we did it. The, to the best we could at the time. And then you start to learn, you know, about things like, you know, fake meat or vegetarian meat and, and those sorts of things and
Sarah (31:37)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, that stuff is trash. Ha ha ha.
Jay (31:54)
Yeah, I mean, you know, and it was coming out at the time we were trying it. So it became an option, right? And so, and then you start to, it's this process of educating yourself. And then we started to understand, you know, for us, for me, you know, that, that bringing back in meat, but meat that was, um, you know, grass-fed, that was organic, that was fed an organic diet. Cause we, you're eating whatever that animal ate, right? In some ways and, and trying to figure these things out. And I think the.
Sarah (31:59)
Yeah.
Jay (32:24)
The thing that has come to my mind or most about all of it is just being more mindful about what you eat. And like you said, I really appreciate the fact that there aren't labels. I try to do the same thing. There aren't labels to things of good or bad. There are things that are good or bad, depending on the slice of the pie that you put them in, right? And so it's not that it's good or bad, it's being more mindful of the connection between not only your body and what you eat,
Sarah (32:31)
Mm-hmm.
Jay (32:54)
And I think that's something I'm working on still, but also the, I don't know the best way to say this, but the, but the long game, right? The call it a day. It took, I feel like such an idiot saying this out loud. And, and, um, we talked a little bit about it in the truck about it yesterday, but I feel like an idiot saying this out loud, but I really, until recently, the last few years, wasn't really aware of, you know, breakfast, lunch, and dinner are all.
Sarah (32:57)
Mm-hmm.
Jay (33:24)
linked to the same day. They were all independent events for me in some ways. And linking the connection between, yeah, if I have a big breakfast because I wake up, I woke up really hungry this morning for whatever reason, probably because we had a nice lunch yesterday, but we also had what are 40 stairs in doubles up and down and pretty good dive and all that. My body was tired, went to bed.
Sarah (33:28)
Mm-hmm.
Jay (33:53)
ran softball practice last night for two hours. And then, you know, I woke up hungry, but I also knew like, I kinda wanna have a bigger lunch today. That's just what I wanna do. And so I'm gonna not eat a big breakfast, even though I'm really hungry, I'm gonna have some beans. I had a little, some beans and some rice and be happy with it. And then I'll have a bigger lunch and I'm stringing those things together. And that awareness becomes something that now I can operate within.
Sarah (33:55)
Hmm
Jay (34:23)
Um, or like a good example too, becomes like, Oh, at night for whatever reason, softball girl softball, that's what I'm, my girls are all into right now. So of course I'm in it and, uh, and help coach the team and all that. It, it, the lifeblood of girls softball seems to be pizzerias. So, you know, okay, Hey, tonight there's going to be a softball meetup, whatever.
Sarah (34:42)
That tracks. Yeah, that tracks.
Jay (34:51)
And you know, it's going to be at a pizza place and pizza is like, you know, some of them have other options. Some of them don't. So if I'm going to have pizza tonight, you know, I have a couple of slices of pizza. I probably shouldn't have a bigger lunch or that, you know, probably have my awesome little salad that I make with a, you know, some grilled chicken on it. Be amazing. So I can prepare for that. So it's just stringing it together. It was changed things for me. And then, and then the mindfulness around that is important.
Sarah (34:56)
Delicious.
Yeah, it's just about balance, right? Like, it's about balance and making sure that you are fueled in the way that you can handle yourself. Like yesterday, I just want to tell this story because I thought it was, I've been laughing at it ever since. But like yesterday was a decently, there was a moment that was like, we used some power, right? Like we needed to,
get ourselves through something that was a little bit hairy for a second. And, um, it was funny cause we went in and it was this crevice and there was a lot of surge and everything. And, uh, there was a point where we got just whitewashed, right? Like it was hard to see. Um, I was, so we had, uh, our friend's buddy who had been there many times, who was leading, he disappeared from in front of me, I was just like, well, Mitch is gone, like, okay.
Jay (35:55)
Yeah
Yeah. See ya.
Sarah (36:21)
And then I was second and Jay was third. Yeah, that's been the joke with, I've been talking about the experience just like, oh, bitch is gone, like what to do? Like, but you know, there was this point where, you know, that happened and I was like, okay, I don't know where I'm going. I, but I know that I know how to deal with this. So like I got close to the ground and then I started.
Jay (36:31)
Yeah.
Sarah (36:49)
just following, like feeling the ocean. I'm like, where is it wanting to take me? Where do I need to go? And just sort of followed that route, right? There were a couple of options, but I was like, it's wanting to take me this way. So I'm gonna go this way. And I was swimming, you know, I would rest when I was getting pulled and then like swim with the wave as it was going. But like, you know, you're working. Like you're working to keep yourself safe.
and got out of it. And I'm like, well, Mitch is still gone, but I'm not gonna lose Jay. So I like turned around once I was out of it and I was shining my bright video light at you. And then I saw your bright primary. I was like, okay, we at least got each other. Now we gotta find Mitch. And then Mitch was there. Like he was there the whole time, but it was just because of the visibility and where he was that was a little bit dicey. But that, you know, I felt...
Jay (37:35)
Yeah.
Sarah (37:46)
very capable, one, because I have experience in nastier conditions, guiding in Komodo, but two, I had, because of our experience at the shores, I had a lot of water, electrolytes, and food, and I felt ready for that. So that's really, we always want to be prepared for worst case scenario.
Jay (37:53)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. My experience of that little crevice, that section of the crevice, I mean, number one, it was beautiful section. I mean, the whole thing was just pretty. It's a, I think a nature preserve. And so you can't, you know, people can't go in there and fish or take anything. So it's, it's really a beautiful dive. Um, I enjoyed it, but yeah, we, we kind of got to that section where it was at the bottom of this little hill, or, you know, for lack of a better word, it was bottom of the hill.
Sarah (38:21)
Mm-hmm.
Jay (38:42)
And, uh, and you see in the water, it's no longer particulate. It's little bubbles and you go, Oh, it's something's coming. Right. And you go, all right. And so I looked up and there you are. And I could see you kind of going, do you have that like, let's do it. You know, it's gear up and I'm like, all right, this next session is going to be a little, little hairy. I don't know what's going to happen. And I'll.
Sarah (38:57)
Nyehehehe
I had actually put away my GoPro, because I was like, I'm gonna just like get ready for this. Like something about this feels like I don't want my GoPro out.
Jay (39:07)
Yeah.
Yeah, I wasn't sure where we were heading. I mean, because you and I have never dove that site before. So we didn't, you know, we had a, and I think Mitch did a really nice job of, you know, and we talked about it before the dive of giving us an overview. And we asked him, you know, tell us about the site and you know, what, how it's laid out and all those things. And we were able to see it actually on Google Maps because at low tide, it actually shows kind of how it's laid out. So you have an idea in your head.
Sarah (39:24)
Totally.
Jay (39:40)
which goes back to diving with new people and new locations and things we've been talking about before, you know, getting some education and asking somebody beforehand. But yeah, you went, off you went, you got your GoPro ready and everything tied to the body and off you went and into the white, right? I mean, you're gone. That's just the way it goes. That's that's that was that section. And so I knew it was, you know, I waited for the next search to take my turn and all I knew was we're going up the hill. I had no idea from there, right?
just like you. And then yeah, you're in the whitewash, you can't see anything. That surge was pretty strong. I mean, I was about to hit my regulator if I was straight on it and flow my regulator. Like it was a little strong for me in that one section. Yeah, it pushed.
Sarah (40:22)
Really? I'm also, I'm coming from the experience of Komodo, so I was like, eh, it's not that bad.
Jay (40:31)
Yeah, you were fine. I felt it on the rag, like putting some positive pressure on the rag. All right.
Sarah (40:36)
Yeah, no, it was, it was good. It was exciting.
Jay (40:40)
And yeah, I came out and I hit the same thing. There was a sector spot where you could go right or you could go left. And it's like, I don't know. And it's not like you're making that decision sitting there in calm water, thinking about it. It's being pushed one way or the other, I'm gonna follow the ocean, because I think that's probably what happened and did and came right out. And then yeah, as I kind of swam up the other section and through the whitewash, I saw your light pointing back at me, I shined my light up.
gave you a big circle like, Hey, I'm okay. Are you okay? And you said, yeah, I'm okay. And boom, okay, I'll swim towards you. And we were out of it. It wasn't a big deal, right? But again, it comes back to, we had the nutrition, we had not only nutrition, but we had an understanding of the dive site. We had an understanding of each other, right? We, uh, all these sorts of things where that situation could with under certain different divers.
Sarah (41:08)
No.
Mm-mm.
Jay (41:37)
could get hairy.
Sarah (41:39)
Yeah, you wouldn't want to like 100% shaws is like Mitch was saying, it's a great place for new divers to go. But that area like the crevice and all of those tiny swim throughs, you really only want to do that if you know where you're going. And especially if you're a newer diver and less experienced with surge or current or whatever, not do that if it's a surgy day. Because like
Jay (42:04)
Yeah, no.
Sarah (42:05)
And I even said to you guys, like even with my experience, if I had gone there and it was just the two of us and I was guiding us blind into this dive site, which I do all the time, right? I go to dive sites and I don't know more than what the dive shop told me about or what I can see on Google Maps. Like if I had approached that area without someone who has been there many, many times, I would have been like, let's not do this.
Jay (42:32)
Yeah, let's turn it around. Yeah.
Sarah (42:33)
Like, let's just not, this is not worth it. Because you don't know, you don't know, especially when it's a place where there's so many different avenues that you can take, and some of them are dead ends, and you're dealing with surge that is going into rocks. Like, you can get properly hurt in those kinds of places. So it's about judgment calls too.
Jay (42:51)
Yeah.
Yep. Absolutely. Absolutely agree. Yeah. And it turned out to be a wonderful, I mean, I've had an amazing dive, such a good dive. Yeah. And at what? 20 feet, 30 feet max. I mean, and it's super fun. Yeah. Uh, the, the fan coral just all over the place, beautiful. And actually the surge makes that even more beautiful cause you have the nice flowing of all the, you know, sea grass and the seaweed and all that, the kelp forest.
Sarah (43:00)
It was so good. It was so good. I loved it. Yeah, it was so much fun.
Jay (43:25)
Amazing. But yeah, we can reminisce. So back to nutrition. As we, as we go down a finger of our own of things. So for me, I'll give you a hit list real quick of things that I try to keep around me in a dive and how I approach it, um, as well for, for other, uh, travel, but things like avocados, sweet potatoes, rice beans, that I already mentioned, um, salmon.
Sarah (43:29)
Hehehehe
Jay (43:53)
I really, for some reason, connects in diving Greek yogurt with a little bit of honey because I need a little sweetness. That's just me or raisins. Coconut milk, you can pick up cartons of it and coconut water at Costco. So one of the things that I try to do, and again, you're in a little bit of a different situation, but the same.
Sarah (43:59)
Mm-hmm.
Jay (44:19)
is when I'm traveling for diving, one of the things I try to do in my first day is to go to a grocery store and to be able to get some of these. You know, if I'm in a hotel, you know, you know, usually there's a mini fridge or you can, you know, figure out a way to keep things cool. But to get some of these things so that you have them and you can then use them when you need them. And so whether that's the night before hydrating, I like to eat some, you know,
Sarah (44:25)
Yeah.
Jay (44:48)
when I wake up the first thing in the morning, some slow burning carbohydrates, rice and beans, avocados, sweet potatoes, the things I mentioned that morning for breakfast and fuel up a bit. Because your body is not only exerting physical energy around the swimming, whether it be long surface swim or surgy conditions or just a normal dive, you're being physical. You're also physical in...
the entry and the exit. And depending on that, you know, Lahore shores is a long surface swim that kicks your butt. Lahore Cove is feels like a long climb when you're coming out of a dive up a bunch of stairs, you know, in doubles, um, through a parking lot. Uh, this, this dive site yesterday was, you know, a nice, easy entry from the shore, but what did Mitch say? 40 stairs, something like that up and down, um, this hill.
Uh, so, you know, you're physically lifting weights for that time period, but that's on you. You had what, you know, a bunch of weight strapped to your back, right? Um, and so thinking about those things, I like to eat before fuel up for it, and then be able to have things also that I can grab, like the cliff bars or the, the kids cliff bar, which are called Z bars, you know, like a hundred calories. And they're a nice little shot of slow burning.
carbohydrates and fuel for me. And I like to kind of space it out in the sense of, you know, eating something early in the morning, if you know, a few hours, three or four hours before you're gonna dive, then having a little something a little smaller that's maybe faster burning than having a little Z bar that has, you know, the chocolate chips in it that make it taste good, but it's gonna burn faster. And then you kind of have a good situation. And that's just how I approach it. You know, I've worked with a nutritionist or anything like that, but been trying to kind of go big.
medium small, meaning leading up to the time I'm getting in the water from a meal perspective and a nutrition perspective. And I'll tell you the worst I've ever felt is when either I don't eat anything, I just neglect it like the whole is yours, or I eat way too big, like way too complex, way too many calories and way too much like, you know, a big sandwich or something, you know, like no good for me.
Sarah (47:04)
Mm-hmm.
Just volume.
Yeah, yeah, I'm big on having, like you said, when you go somewhere new or fly somewhere, I like to get nuts, nuts and fruit because that's really easy to travel with and it's, you know, fats and protein, right? And then fruits will get you that kind of boost and whatever, but yeah, I don't...
I don't really like the bars and things, but I can see their appeal in this kind of environment. But yeah, I think the biggest thing is just listen to your body, because I know a lot of people who also just don't do well with eating. If they have anything that's, any kind of substance, they feel just sick during the dive.
You know, so it might be adjusting like your diving schedules so that maybe you do just one dive and then you're able to eat after Something like that. So it's just about understanding your body and like being kind to it If you can only do one dive in a day Like I prefer for shore diving to just do one long dive I feel great after that if i'm pushing myself and I do two or three dives like I Run the risk of not feeling as good. Whereas if i'm on a boat
totally different story, right? Because you're not doing as much work. That's just me. But yeah, I would love to hear what people, like their experience with this. So if you wanna share about nutrition, your favorite dive snacks, drinks, hydration, whatever, like you can share that in our Facebook group, which we're being more active in. We have been doing that. Go us.
Jay (48:34)
Yeah, it's true.
Yes we are. Yes.
Sarah (49:00)
And also we have emails, so you can email either Jay or myself, Sarah with an H at thedivetable.com.
Jay (49:10)
Yes, and as we wrap this one up, I wanted to give a little shout out to a few listeners that have sent us some messages. And I just wanna shout them out as I think this would be nice. So one, a big shout out to Steve. Steve, I guess you could mention his last name or should we not? I don't know, why not? Just first names, okay. So I wanna wrap this one up with some...
Sarah (49:32)
I would just say first names, I think. Yeah.
Jay (49:39)
Shout outs to some listeners that have reached out to us and with their messages. So shout out to Steve, who's based in San Diego. Steve, it was great to meet you at the meetup and we appreciate you being a listener but also appreciate your incredible email to me and all that and really thoughtful way of talking about things and glad to be connected. And then one more shout out to Scott.
Scott, I don't know where you are based. Otherwise, I would call that out. But Scott, thanks for your kind message and for shooting us a message and really appreciate you being a listener and being out there and looking forward to, hopefully someday, getting to meet up with you and go diving. So just wanted to wrap it up with a couple shout outs and yeah, we're being more active on our Facebook group. And I will say, if you send Sarah and I an email, we read every email.
And we will reply to every email. So I will make that promise on both of our behalves because I believe that that's who we are. And so if you're thinking out there, oh, they don't have time to listen to, you know, to hear from me, we will read it and we will reply to it because we're so excited to build this community and that you're a part of it. So shoot us an email, connect with us on Facebook group. Uh, and yeah, I think, uh, any, any parting thoughts there, Sarah? Yeah. Feel your dive. Yeah. Feel your dive.
Sarah (51:00)
No, eat well, treat your body right. Yeah.
Jay (51:03)
Eat well. Put it on a shirt.
Sarah (51:06)
That's it. All right.
Jay (51:10)
Alright, well we'll hear you on the next episode of The Dive Table.
